Test taking=> lost memory

HELLO EVERYONE

I'm so excited to be mod this week, although this week is one of the busiest weeks yet!
But that's ok! hang in there guys! Almost summer vacation!

OKiee, so... here is my ultimate question of the week (or of a lifetime):

If we are unable to recall of retreat information because of our minds blocking or not accessing the memory, and we believe/ think that we are only the mind with no higher self (the Being/ Universal Sould/ Connected oneness/ essence) if we were all ignorant of that, would we ever be able to eventually remember this memory, or access it? or would it remain blocked?
SO.. essentially what i mean is, those who are ignorant most likely think that they're living in, as what WE WOULD call it, the mind-- like how many of us were before we entered Ms.Kay's teachings. Now we are aware, through precise and critically thought out ideas, that the MIND, and the BEING are separate entities. Thus, everytime we start getting angry or start feeling excited, we have to think twice--in terms of the mind and in terms of the Being. This is precisely what critical thinking is. Everytime we act/ react, we always have to question ourselves--asking if this is the result of the mind or the Being.. and that if this "thing" here is the mind reacting. or is it a spontaneous insight from our essence/Being--referred to as INTUITION? We have to do so much more thinking and this makes our thoughts much more complicated. We have a much more intricate and complex outlook know that we have this piece of information added in our heads.

So in another way, you can view my question like this, in a more general basis:

Do people who are ignorant have it easier? because they don't have to think so much, having these complex thoughts act as obstacles to block us from our memory. i mean, who can really concentrate on accessing that piece of information locked into your memory when you have all these thoughts regarding the mind, the Being, the Universal SOul, happiness, the new, non-local domain, essence etc. coming out of your mind AT THE SAME FRICKIN TIME?! So is being ignorant better off--i know that the immediate answer would be 'NO'. But think about it please. Is it? i mean what you can't know won't hurt you right? Maybe being ignorant isn't being better off in terms of the whole-- but selfishly, in terms of one's happiness/one's individual life... would you rather be ignorant or be wise/intelligent?

I know that many of you have mentioned that you've been less happy now that you know so much, and think so much about the mind and the Being etc. Ignorance is bliss, but still ignorance--what you don't know, however, can't hurt you. So what do you guys think? feel free to digress (not too much though) !

http://www.pioneerthinking.com/cgi-bin/mb/YaBB.pl?num=1244435520/0

(up) this is just a forum on how to help your memory and remedies and food will enhance your memory.. this is just for your own benefit lol, i didn't post on this one.

http://eckhart-tolle-forum.inner-growth.info/viewforum.php?f=10

this forum is a forum created by fans of Eckhart Tolle-- incredible. It discusses not only my question but also everything else we've been talking about. Prev. Mods-- take a look if you guys didn't find an answer yet! Great ideas.

I'm still waiting on NeuroTalk Communities... I don't know why but I'm black-listed on their forum so apparently I'm banned.
Also i'm still in the process of searching for good forums because i found out that i have to be a physician of some sort or a college student to join the forums links I've collected before.

i'll update you!

hmmm interesting question. actually being ignorant has its ups and downs. for one thing ignorant people are less likely to perceive the emotions and the aura of others. however, they are less likely to be offended and affected by others. i personally believe ignorance is bliss, but that depends on the situation. you wouldn't want to be identified as, to put this is the easiest way of describing, 白目 right? i think ignorance is sometimes optional. once in a while i choose to be ignorant because it can be overly complicated to get involved with the situation.

can ignorance be a result of confidence? when one is arrogant, isnt one more likely to be ignorant as well?

im keeping this short for the minute but i promise ill reply later

Ah, that question of ignorance vs. knowledge. I swear, I come across these questions at least once every week.

First of all, ignorance does not necessarily mean that one has less to think about. We can be ignorant of just about anything, and yet we can still be burdened with thoughts. Sometimes, being less ignorant means that you calm your mind down. Let's say you're sitting right next to this box. This box makes some strange noise. If you are completely ignorant, your mind can wander on and on just trying to figure out what or why is the box making the noise. If you aren't, you'll just say "oh, it's just -insert something-."

Similarly, by being knowledgeable about everything we've come in contact in Ms. Kay's class, really, we're not really complicating our minds further. We can always use our beginner's mind and meditation, which actually does the reverse: it clears our mind of distractions and complications. And I disagree with the 'what you don't know won't hurt you' thing. Easy example is global warming. Even if we're ignorant of global warming, well, it'll still hurt us (or burn us). We can also be ignorant of our own behavior and scare away potential acquaintances, only to wonder in the end "why the hell am I not making any friends?" Really, the list goes on and on and on.

Oh, and, either I haven't been very active on the forum or I've mistaken the posts around here, I don't really know if anyone's actually less happy once they know more. I don't know. Maybe it's just me, but knowledge really doesn't affect my happiness level in a major way. Really.

And this is the time I jut out to avoid further confusion.

Thanks for your feedback Ivy and PHil

@IVY'S:

can ignorance be a result of confidence? when one is arrogant, isnt one more likely to be ignorant as well?

That's a really good question Ivy! In my opinion, it DOES relate: ignorance and arrogance--sometimes. Yeah, if one is arrogant, he/she will probably be reluctant to be in search for truth or any further knowledge-- as arrogance is being excessively confident/proud. However, i do question though, how does one choose to be ignorant?? If one believes so and so to be true, then one will stop searching right? but that's just called believing in something, AND it's called ignorance... but then ignorance just grows on us doesn't it? It's not like we know there is more to it than ____THIS, but we don't want to search for more.. that's called keeping ignorance. so explain, please, how one chooses literally, to be ignorant. Ignorant people-- is it their fault for being ignorant?

@PHIL'S:

Similarly, by being knowledgeable about everything we've come in contact in Ms. Kay's class, really, we're not really complicating our minds further. We can always use our beginner's mind and meditation, which actually does the reverse: it clears our mind of distractions and complications

Thanks for that clarification! Yes, what you said is very helpful and most certainly makes sense, however, doesn't this increase our complexity in thoughts? and then doesn't this raise confusion or search for more and more answers? doesn't our minds go into overdrive producing more thoughts on these topics, since it is regarding the most fundamental aspects of our lives--- which is, our life, in general. So which way is it? I feel like sometimes these twisted/complex concepts and ideas is making me more in the mind than in the Being. I don't even think I've experience being in the state of the Being yet. this is awful! EVERYTHING IS SO COMPLICATED. ignorance is a form of simplicity. Is that better?

EVERYONE: if you were given a choice to know everyhthing in the world--i mean EVERYTHING, EVERY SINGLE THING, and a choice to only know as much as you will know in your whole lifetime, which one would you choose?

Knowledge in your lifetime< knowledge of the universe.

** someone answer my question about memory please:D

http://www.brainmindforum.co.uk/forum/postlist/1

This is another forum that i've found. Go to their science homepage and it has a lot of factual information and different categories regarding neuroscience! enjoy:D i don't know if I'll be posting much on that one because the editors will have to check it out before i can actually make my own thread. I've already posted to the editors though.

I'll find more links that you guys can also refer to! Probably after school or sometime at night. alrighty then! ttyl!

KNOWLEDGE IN MY LIFETIME, answer to your new question
Good stuff btw
Anyways, to elaborate on my answer, think about how big our universe is first, actually, don't think, just sort of lightly touch on the notion of its size, already that little gesture has probably sent you reeling. While there are a lot of things I would like to know, like why people put an "s" in the word "lisp" or whose bright idea it was to look at a cow and say, "I think I’ll squeeze these pink dangly things here, and drink whatever comes out," I think knowing the true nature of the universe would probably drive me insane. Even though we believe that humans have unlimited potential in their thinking, this might actually just be a judgment based on our limited observation of the powers of the human mind, maybe we really aren't as unlimited as we think, anyways, even if we are all powerful, Jesus, absorbing that much information and understanding it would require friggin millions of years of balls to the wall thinking and much eye rubbing and neck cricking. And things would get pretty boring too, like, once you know how everything works, you wouldn't be able to be surprised by anything at all, ever again. But yeah, I think i'd be better off not having my brain reduced to so many little bits and pieces of juicy sausage.

To answer your initial question though, people who are ignorant about things have it harder, if you're ignorant you choose to not see the things already laid out in front of you, and well. People who don't want the truth, don't know the truth, but they know that it exists, and I dunno about you but when I'm doing something that I know is wrong, and yet I don't want to take the proper step, I start becoming prone to teeth gnashing and swearing.

Thanks Ken, i agree with you man! Knowing everything is just too much.

So what do you think about how the mind? how it blocks us from accessing memory... our minds blocks us from a lotta things--not just repressing memory. Our mind=> thoughts=> bunched up emotions at one time=> confusion=> obstacles or messiness=> not clearing the head=> not accessing the right memory. YOu see? i kinda want to hear what you think

HEY EVERYONE! you know that forum link i posted--Eckhart Tolle-- yeah these are some of the really awesome feedback i've received from the members of that forum. It talks about everything-- so you guys should check it out.
If you can't access it, google: Eckhart Tolle Forum-- click the first one that says introduction. Cool? cool.
yayyyyyy

The ego itself is not even real. Its simply a thought created sense of self derived from conditioned thinking.

Repression is one mechanism the mind utilizes to overcome traumatic thinking, or more broadly, to overcome suffering. Some thoughts are so emotionally unpleasant to indulge in, the mind becomes conditioned to never think about them again. If one were to read a book on spirituality, or perform self inquiry as to why certain conditioned dysfunctional behavior is manifesting in one's life, the repressed thoughts can resurface. I would attribute this more toward seeing through the false story of separate self with the mind itself, rather than a realization of Oneness. Turn the mind on itself, and it can dig up pretty much anything. Therapists and psychiatrists can help one cope with the resurfacing of repressed thoughts. Spiritual teachings can show you that no thoughts are ultimately real, that no thought can encapsulate what you are. Hence the repressed memories, eventually, are seen as irrelevant

Being is transpersonal and the experience of it is nonmental

since we are not really our mind, but rather we are simply an expression of Source in the present moment with a body/mind on earth as the principal observational platform, our fundamental Self (Being) is always there (it's the only reality). And once our "little me" is seen as the restricted, conditioned, carefully but erroneously labelled identity we have believed in, anything can happen.

welll. i think ignorance is a choice. one can choose to be ignorant, simply because he/she is uninterested in the situation and feels that ignorance is the easiest way of getting out. just a personal reference, sometimes i choose to ignore my surrounding because i think the situation is overly complicated and i have no sorts of interest in wasting my time in it. but that is just me. one can choose to be aware of the world surrounding them or not, so i suppose ignorance does happen by choice

but then, there is always a backside. ignorance can also be one who is blind to the situation and not be aware. for those who have a simple view on the world, they may sometimes be ignorant to the world, because they do not see from a holistic view. but for the people who think before they act and have an overly complicated and scheming mind, ignorance is by choice. especially when they think it does not really concern them. well, i suppose that is a haughty behavior, because they never expect these things to happen to them, or they simple assume that the way the world revolves does not really affect them at all, thus they do not take a stand. well, kind of like neutral, because they don't want to know. i think.

So kind of like our discussions regarding the environment right? How the owners of the big corporations and industries and superfluous companies on their road to success/opulence are choosing to ignore the environmental impacts as well as humanitarian impacts they are putting into our world. Yeah. thanks IVY:D

stephsquared wrote:Thanks Ken, i agree with you man! Knowing everything is just too much.

So what do you think about how the mind? how it blocks us from accessing memory... our minds blocks us from a lotta things--not just repressing memory. Our mind=> thoughts=> bunched up emotions at one time=> confusion=> obstacles or messiness=> not clearing the head=> not accessing the right memory. YOu see? i kinda want to hear what you think

I'm actually not too clear on the subject of memory and how it's blocked. But to take a guess...erm, memory...mm, our minds prevent us from accessing our memory sometimes by...hm. Actually, I have absolutely no idea -_-, at the moment I don't even have scratch to work with to formulate an idea and go on from there, I'm completely in the dark here, maybe someone else should try to answer and I can build on that?

stephsquared wrote:

Thanks Ken, i agree with you man! Knowing everything is just too much.

So what do you think about how the mind? how it blocks us from accessing memory... our minds blocks us from a lotta things--not just repressing memory. Our mind=> thoughts=> bunched up emotions at one time=> confusion=> obstacles or messiness=> not clearing the head=> not accessing the right memory. YOu see? i kinda want to hear what you think

I'm actually not too clear on the subject of memory and how it's blocked. But to take a guess...erm, memory...mm, our minds prevent us from accessing our memory sometimes by...hm. Actually, I have absolutely no idea -_-, at the moment I don't even have scratch to work with to formulate an idea and go on from there, I'm completely in the dark here, maybe someone else should try to answer and I can build on that?

You say that: "Our mind=> thoughts=> bunched up emotions at one time=> confusion=> obstacles or messiness=> not clearing the head=> not accessing the right memory."

If that is so, then everything in the physical realm is capable of being affected by the mind too. Sometimes the mind can mess up stuff, but isn't it something natural? Think about it, our minds get into these "messy" states when it goes into overload. This overload is just like any other overload; too much of something cause negative outcomes. To say our minds are capable of being messy is like saying today I am having a bad day. Sometimes the unfortunate thing just happen to be the one thing that disadvantages you while it benefits the other. There is always these strong polar opposites (good/bad..etc) so it is only natural that our minds go haywire and malfunction once in a while.

To think about it, everything we say about the mind is usually negative. We tend to discuss this because we want to break away from the mind after realizing its potentially harmful. But....have you ever thought of some other twist of logic?
For an example, can Being can go overload and affect mind negativly? Is Being potentially harmful?

@ Ken's: That's alright, i developed this question while discussing Emerson-- and we were just talking about how if we are not able to calm ourselves--stabilize the mind--stop, come back to a better and more grounded state, then we will let something like this happen--mind blocking memory; we won't be able to tap in our own memory, as OSHO i believe, has stated. THat memory-- we want to hold on to it, but it's dead, it's in the past. OUr minds feeds on memory to grow so sometimes it blocks memory with the over-production of thought after thought---so we deceive ourselves and believe that we WANT to remember this piece of information and that we NEED to remember specifically from the past (we get nervous or worried if we don't remember) but the thing is, *this is something i got from external sources*, that being in the present moment, being in the NOW, quiets the mind-- manifests Being. If you are in the state of Self or Being-- we are more collected and down to earth-- we are able to do everything in that present moment being fully ourselves. Thus in the present moment-- Being-- not focusing on mind-based and product-of-the-mind thoughts, we can focus more on what we need to remember, for that particular occasion. Tapping into memory is not living in the past--it's just taking knowledge you have right now, that you've received before from previous experiences-- this doesn't mean that we're dwelling and suspending ourselves in that moment. It's a more objective sense-- trying to remember information. This, in a general picture, is trying to control the mind, like how we've been learning to this whole year. Controlling the mind= more in the NOW or in the PRESENT-- kind of what meditation brings, a manifestation of the Being and quieting to the mind. Yep, hope this help you build kenny.

@Andy's:

To think about it, everything we say about the mind is usually negative. We tend to discuss this because we want to break away from the mind after realizing its potentially harmful. But....have you ever thought of some other twist of logic?
For an example, can Being can go overload and affect mind negativly? Is Being potentially harmful?

Thanks for your feedback Andy! Brings a new perspective to my thread discussion. Well, I'm not sure how to answer your question but I'll take a stab at it. From all the great writers' works, Being is defined as a wholeness of YOU, the basis/fundamental/essential part of YOU. It is your ESSENCE--core. IT IS GENUINE and PURELY YOU, ANDY'S individuality. (not sure of the wording, sorry, do please correct me if i'm wrong) If it is the purest state of your essence, andy, then hm...is it possible to over into overdrive/ overload. Being IS the only reality--technically speaking, because when you're in the NOW it's what's being manifested right? yes. Ok. So Being is the "actual" reality (general terms) then you are reality. Like deepak Chopra said, YOU ARE EVERYTHING. is there a sense of overload/overdrive in that? What do you think? thanks for your thoughts, andy!

Hiii I think i know what you mean, and I think that there is a way to remove the block that you speak of, though sometimes it may require a bit more than just plain thought? When you panic naturally everything becomes tenser and it would seem like your thinking is tainted by this nervousness. Before tests i think part of thhe block may also be a physiological symptom, like if you have not had a good night's sleep the night before and are tired, or like did not eat breakfast and no nutrients is reaching your brain, or if you're suffering from an insufficient amoutn of O2... those could all be things that owuld prevent clear thinking, right? But as for if it's just the panic that blocks the memory.. i dont know, i think it's possible to remove it. There have been times during tests when i tried to relax, i looked aorund the room, and i was suddenly inspired to write an answer, which turned out to be correct. Would that be intuition manifested?

Ignorance IS bliss... but owuldn't being ignorant sorta mean that you're not taking the responsibility to know the world that you're currently in habiting? Like you don't really want to find out more about the world and to do right for it - but instead you're just letting things pass and not bothering with the questions? WOuldn't that be like NOT thinking?

The subject of lost memory is kind of like the subject of awareness. What is generally most appropriate and more to the point, what is best for you.

The first impression that struck me was the idea about what each person in Ms K's class will retain one year, ten years, and 50 years from now. In my view, it is up to each person. Those who wish to discount all the information can do so with extensive rationalizations. Those who wish to retain all of it can do so by building upon it. I see that answer as a choice.

The 2nd impression that struck me was the idea about what we can know as a conscious ego mind. How extensive can the human perception of reality become. I would say not as much as we would like. The present human potential for logical comprehension and assimilation is quite primitive as I see it. Evolved ET's that are like us physically and have had physical expression for millions of years more than us have a greater capasity for awareness then our culture has at this time. I see the need for greater humility.

The 3rd impression that struck me was the idea about what we can bring into focus from our inner being or grand awareness. That's the know it all part of ourself. The answer is we can get what we need to support the choices we have made. We will never know as much as we would like to know and there are some things, by design, that will always be unknowable to the conscious physical form or the ego mind.

The last impression I will comment on is around the idea about memory retention from lifetime to lifetime. The answer to this is connected to choice again. When we choose to connect to our inner self and be all that we can be in this physical expression, we can also access all the wisdom we have gathered from previous lifetimes. When we choose to ignore the potentials that hide within the self, they remain there quietly. They do not pop out to disrupt the life we have chosen to have this time around. They hide from us.

My experiences with these subjects reflects the 50 or so years I have been living with them. They also reflect the various choices I have made over that period of time. The wise ones in this group will apply what is appropriate and disregard the rest.

John

"Ignorance IS bliss... but owuldn't being ignorant sorta mean that you're not taking the responsibility to know the world that you're currently in habiting? Like you don't really want to find out more about the world and to do right for it - but instead you're just letting things pass and not bothering with the questions? WOuldn't that be like NOT thinking?" (Annie)

Rather than straight out NOT thinking, isn't it more thinking and deciding not to think. I think ignorance is a consious choice. (Like Ivy.)

So with that in mind, "do people who are ignorant have it easier because they don't think/know as much?" Ermm, I guess with their ignorace they forgo much of the experience of life. We see that there are often good and bad sides to one concept--if one decides to be ignorant to distance the self from the negative, one misses out on the positive. So it's kind of a trade off? Btw, I still think that people are a species meant to think. I said this in another discussion before..our brains were meant for thinking. Not thinking leaves this powerful cerebral cortex of ours idle and useless. So for the "transcedence" of the human race, I still think it's better for people to more or less THINK.
Or maybe society just looks down upon the "ignorant" because it is jealous of blissfully ignorant people. Ha.

its been a rough week and i finally have the time to post on the forums.

Ignorance is bliss. I hear it all the time, movies tell me, people tell me, yet is it really? I mean thinking more isnt always a bad thing, unless its on overdrive. So thinking is good in general, yet siddartha and many people strive to clear away thoughts from the mind and become content by just being one, producing no thoughts, having a blank mind with a clear conscious. No matter if its possible or not, i was just thinking...isnt it ideal to just be able to shift between producing thoughts, and the next moment switch it off to just gather energy from the surroundings.

Many things we use these days are able to be switched on or off. We can either use our cellphones or not use them. Simply, we can turn on the lights whenever we want, and then turn if off by means of free will. We an hoose to read a book, we can choose to throw away trash, type letters, use smiley faces, yet we can not choose to shut off our thoughts, we can not choose to be whose child, we can not choose who we are inside.

I believe, this is just me speakin here, that ignorance is bliss is coming from those who arent ignorant, coming from people who are educated in a way that they feel confident about themselves and knowing that they know. It is like those being ill saying a good health is truely blissful, yet during conditions of great health, we people tend to forget, or take good health as granted. What im trying to communicate here is that, ignorance is like good health, those of seek it, need it, desperately trying to find it, might think of it as contentment, a path to happiness, or even a gateway to heaven. For those that are ignorant, for those that have good health, they take it as granted, they ignore the fact that being healthy is fortunate. What is truley bliss, are those who are ignorant, no, it is those that are truely ignorant, and find themselves happy about it. The only people with good health are those who know they have good health and are happy about it, not taking it for granted, and finding themselves fortunate.

@ John's: Hi John!

My experiences with these subjects reflects the 50 or so years I have been living with them. They also reflect the various choices I have made over that period of time.

incredible. it's pretty amazing how you've worked and dealt with these concepts for so long and that you're so experienced and familiar with these ideas. I'm very grateful for these answers/comments

The 3rd impression that struck me was the idea about what we can bring into focus from our inner being or grand awareness. That's the know it all part of ourself. The answer is we can get what we need to support the choices we have made. We will never know as much as we would like to know and there are some things, by design, that will always be unknowable to the conscious physical form or the ego mind.

The last impression I will comment on is around the idea about memory retention from lifetime to lifetime. The answer to this is connected to choice again. When we choose to connect to our inner self and be all that we can be in this physical expression, we can also access all the wisdom we have gathered from previous lifetimes. When we choose to ignore the potentials that hide within the self, they remain there quietly. They do not pop out to disrupt the life we have chosen to have this time around. They hide from us

Yes, agreed. The universe probably has layers and layers and dimension after dimension of the unknown. We're just on the surface or the top layer. We're only a tiny aspect of the entire grand universe. In some ways, we're bound to be ignorant to a certain degree. However, we do have the choice of the degree of ignorance we're bounded to have. We have "unlimited human potential"--perhaps the wisdom gathered from our previous lives. WE have the ability to alter our reality to/ to change the reality, the future from within ourselves--the answers are within ourselves, our Being beacuse the Being is all we are-- we just have to such transcend mental/physical boundaries and utilize this abundance of potential.

@Steph C's: Hi Steph! Thanks for your feedback! very very helpful! I think that from what you've said, ignorance may be bliss--but it's only bliss to a certain degree, it's bliss that's surface level. And although ignorant people who KNOW that there are answers out there but choose to remain at there present state--not being far-reaching or fulfilling the responsibilities that they have as a human being to know the earth that they're inhabitting (Annie), and to grow, it may be "blissful" to them but doesn't mean that they're better off right? It's still ignorance. By choice, they're choosing to remain ignorant thus dragging many people down with them. What a shame.

@JTizzle's: i think you're absolutely right! It depends on perspective. People who think that they know the truth and the reality might believe that ignorance is bliss. But it's only because the people who know have been through more and have experienced more. What's truely bliss-- is the awareness of what is the truth, and not taking it for granted. The bliss to ignorance is just short-term bliss, or bliss in OUR EYES(people who aren't ignorant, or people who choose to seek answers) but from their perspectives-- they might have problems of their own and they want to solve those problems. But sometimes they can't because they're choosing to remain constant (foolish consistency) and they're not growing spiritrually-- for their Being. Thus yes, those people who are far-reaching and seeking to find out as much truth to fulfill their lives have true bliss.